Talk:Nagi Arisuin

Nagi's gender
Hey, this page misgenders Alice throughout. She's pretty clearly a woman, constantly referring to herself as such, and this page doesn't reflect that. Could someone with the power to edit this page fix this? Scarfired (talk) 20:21, March 6, 2016 (UTC)


 * He's biologically a male, he just thinks and acts as a female but that doesn't make him female. So he'll be listed as a male. End of discussion. 04:34,3/7/2016
 * The topic of LGBT is a too sensitive discussion that often tends to derail discussion no matter where it is opened. As an admin in the Steins;gate Wiki, there have been several occasions where the article on Ruka Urushibara is often edited with the same purpose: to classify Ruka as a transgender because of its definition. HOWEVER, there are no official sources that indicate that Ruka is explicitly classified as transgender and the same case applies to Alice. For that reason, this wiki will assume that he is a male based on conventional classifications of gender. The wiki will stick to this stand, and will not tolerate any kind of aggressive action to oppose this. heraldofmeridian♣ 15:06, March 11, 2016 (UTC)

Leaving LGBT etc bullshit aside, doesn't this character refer to themselves as female? I was under the impression that if every character in a show, including the character in question, refer to someone a certain way, that would be the correct way to refer to them.

This is a situation that needs to be divorced from the politics surrounding it. The purpose of a wiki is to present information in a non-biased manner. It requires fewer assumptions on the creators' behalf to interpret this character as transgendered, and not doing so betrays the very political agenda this admin claimed not to harbor. This is a place for logic, not emotions, and it's very disheartening to see people who claim to be motivated by the former behaving so irrationally.

24.78.122.156 08:53, March 28, 2016 (UTC)guest

I'm acting very rationally. If your father refers himself as a female does it make him a female. No it doesn't, same logic as that. Besides Nagi himself already stated clearly he's biologically a male. 10:55,3/28/2016

Article Transphobia and Inaccuracy
So, this article is very inaccurate. It begins by presenting Arisuin's gender as 'male' despite the fact that by any accepted meaning of the word (either presentation or identity) not fueled by bias she is '''female. 'This article then goes on to present even more ''inaccuracies about transgender people by claiming, despite every single piece of evidence pointing to the contrary, that Arisuin " believes he (she) is a girl trapped inside a man's body." which, again, goes against every bit of evidence avalible to science currently.

I could go on and on about how objectively inaccurate that is, though I'll get to my main point. This article should be changed to reflect the reality of the situation. Arisuin is very clearly a woman by (again) any accepted and reasonable definition of gender, and her gender info and pronouns throughout the article should be fixed to accurately reflect this. This isn't something that's up for debate, the author presented her as a woman, and the denial of this is quite transphobic and the objective rejection of the author's direct purpose. This isn't even to mention the horrendous grammar mistakes throughout the article that I'm, given the writer mindset, not too surprised about. HeartArrow (talk) 08:44, September 23, 2017 (UTC)


 * I would be fine defining Arisuin's gender as female and changing the article, but considering there seems to have been some discussion about this topic previously, the admins should probably also express their opinions. About the grammar, however, I can't agree with you, as looking through the page, I don't notice any of these "horrendous grammar mistakes" you are talking about. But, please by all means, if you see mistaken grammar feel free to fix it Alterdream (talk) 15:15, September 24, 2017 (UTC)

Bias
See, here's the thing: the logical conclusion your obvious bias doesn't seem to be letting you understand. It doesn't matter if you think Alice should be called a female in the article or not. This isn't your work, this is Riku Misora's work. And that means, if Alice is referred to as a "he" in the light novel dialogue and narration, then it's clear the author meant for Alice to still be considered a male, if even only biologically. But that is the basis for decisions like this, not your personal preferences. Now, I haven't seen much of Alice in the light novels for a while and it's been some time since I read the earlier volumes, so I can't say which it is, but my suggestion is to look to the light novels and make a decision based on that. A wiki is about recording information, not making it about some personal agenda, so spare your feelings on the subject and act professionally. I despise seeing comment sections about nonsense like this. --Silver-Haired Seireitou (Dosvidaniya, tovarisch.) 04:38, October 23, 2018 (UTC)

Saying that one conclusion has an "obvious bias" is not arguing in good faith. With that said, the fan translation uses "he" a lot, but we should refer to the Japanese text instead as pronouns are used much less commonly in that language and the fan translation may have erred on the wrong side of things due to widespread ignorance of what being transgender means. Alice saying she's a woman in the body of a man describes that exactly, yet I've seen a lot of people be confused about it and this is far from the only time this has happened in anime. I don't currently own any of the Japanese LN volumes that Alice appears in, so I'll have to investigate this further. However, I would strongly argue against making "Alice is biologically a man and should be referred to as such" the starting line--this in itself introduces bias and opposes not only actual science but contradicts a number of reviews of the anime that refer to Alice as a transgender woman without batting an eye (including Digibro's videos and ANN's episode reviews). --77.161.126.44 08:29, January 15, 2019 (UTC)